ATP - Multi Written Exam Expiration and more

  1. Do you know how long is the ATP- multi or ATM written exam is good for before it expires?

  2. Do you have to take the ATP-CTP course prior to taking the exam? If not, what is the requirement to take the exam? i.e. can I buy the sporty, dauntless, or sheppard’s discs and take the test.

I’ve seen 24 and 60 mths on question 1 and yes and no on question 2.

  1. Can you take the ATM exam prior to making the hour requirement? I’m looking at it from a R-ATP point of view.

Thanks for help

Ryan,

  1. The ATP written exam expires after 60 months.

  2. You will need to take the ATP CTP course prior to taking the written exam. This is actually a good thing. I wrote a large portion of this course, it covers a large number of topics that are really beneficial to new pilots.

  3. You can take the ATP CTP course prior to having the flight time. Remember that to get the R-ATP you will need to graduate from an approved university program.

All of this being said, I would not take either the class or the written exam prior to having the hours necessary to take the full exam. You will be asked about this material when you take the practical exam, I would want my knowledge of it to be as fresh as possible.

Chris

Ryan,

I agree with Chris on this one. I recently went through CTP just prior to ground school at SkyWest, and it was very beneficial to have the material fresh in my head both for the written exam and for the airline training program itself. Transitioning from flight instruction in small props to jets is not as easy as you’d think and the 10hrs of full motion sim time that you get during the CTP really help later on.
Also, the program is pretty expensive (around $5k) to pay out of pocket. You will get it for free when you are hired at an airline, so I wouldn’t hurry.

Yarden

Chris / Yarden,

Thanks for the speedy reply. I should have my bio on my profile, but I’m a retiring Army helicopter pilot with 1800 hours (600 cross country, 550 PIC, 300 Night/NVG, and 150 instrument (real and sim) hours) and about 150 fixed wing hours, including 15 multi-engine hrs. I also have my commercial helicopter / instrument and private airplane single-engine land with instrument ratings. I’ll finish my multi-engine when I return from this deployment.

That’s good news on the ATP expiration. 60 months is a long time; Hopefully it doesn’t take that long to get hired.

Once I make the R-ATP hours (250 TT, 50 MEL), is it your experience that airlines are paying for the CTP, if the applicant doesn’t have it. Or would it benefit me to pay for the CTP and have it before I apply?

Also, I will only have about 12 years left before mandatory retirement, but I want to instruct once its over. So I’m thinking about the ATP course, since they no longer do the add-ons. What is the requirement to stay instructor current? Have you been able to keep currency?

Thanks again

Ryan,

I wouldn’t worry about the CTP course. Once you are hired at any airline, it will be taken care of by the company.

With regards to CFI currency, you must renew your certificate every 2 years. The requirements for renewal are stated in 61.197 of the FARs.

Yarden

Ryan,

After 12 + years at the airlines I still have my CFI’s. Haven’t really needed them but I worked hard for them and it seems a shame to let them lapse. If you actually work part-time as an instructor you only need proof you’ve instructed 5 students in 24 mos. The FARs list all the requirements but different FSDO’s (Flight Standards District Office) interpret them differently when it comes to airline pilots. Some will allow you to renew simply if you’re a Capt at an airline since they consider that a mentor role. When I was a ground instructor at ExpressJet they would allow me to show my students training records. Here in Hawaii they won’t let me use my ground instructor creds (though I disagree) so I’ll have to do one of the online courses.

Nothing for you to really concern yourself about for a while.

Adam

Ryan,

If you are applying to the regionals then I would absolutely let them pay for the CTP course, if you are applying for the majors then I would probably pay for the course myself. That being said, while you do have considerable flight experience what I typically see with pilots in your situation (low fixed wing time) is that they usually work for the regionals for a year or two and then very quickly move onto the majors.

To stay current as a CFI you will need to take a class online every two years. I take mine online and then mail in the completion certificate to the FAA, which renews my license. This is very easy to do and doesn’t cost much. I will say that if I were to actually flight instruct again I would want to take an inperson course that really covered the topics in depth.

Chris

Hi All,

So I’m preparing for applying to several regionals I have approximately 2,000hrs and meet all the hour requirements for an ATP certificate. I have not actively flown for 2 years. I took an ATP written in March 2014 (passed) with intentions of acquiring the cert shotly after. Due to other circumstances this never happened. That being said I have a few questions.

  • Is my written still good? 24 months or 60 months ( I’m pretty sure it’s expired)
  • Do I need to complete an ATP-CTP program prior to applying for the regionals?
  • What training do the regional pick up with regard to ATP cert./written?

Thanks,

Emily

Emily,

Your written has expired.

You do not need to complete the ATP CTP prior to applying to the regionals.

The regionals should provide all of the training necessary for you to obtain an ATP, including the written exam prep.

Chris

Emily,

Everything Chris said but I would get current and do some instrument work. When I was hired back in the day there was a pilot in my newhire class I a similar situation to yours. The airlines will provide you with all the training you need for the ATP CTP and the airplane you’ll be flying but they assume your basic skills (including instrument) are up to speed. The pilot’s I’m referring to was not and failed miserably.

Adam

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Emily,

Yes. You need to retake the ATM written test since you were unable to obtain your ATP cert within 24 calendar months. It will be your responsibility to prepare yourself for the written exam. Sheppard Air is a good test prep tool.

You do not need to complete an ATP CTP course prior to applying for a regional. Let them pay for it.

You won’t be able to start training at a regional until you have completed an ATP CTP course and passed the ATM exam. Since those will be out of the way, they will train you to proficiency to take the ATP check ride.

It will be expected that you show up with a minimum level of knowledge and proficiency. I strongly suggest getting a BFR and renewing your Instrument currency.

Tory

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Thank you, thank you, thank you!

You guys are top notch!

I will most definitely be current with a BFR and IPC prior to applying. I’m currently studying now and brushing up on jepps as much as I can and I plan to be as instrument proficient as possible.

I’m currently reading “Everything Explained for the Professional Pilot” and I have a current FAR/AIM. Do you guys have any other recommended study material?

Is it worth putting my expired written results on my current resume? Any resume tips?

Troy thanks for the Sheppard tip! Prior to interviewing I hope to be pre-studied for the written.

You guys are a lot of help! Thank you again.

Emily

Everything explained is a good resource, and entertaining. Put emphasis on the 135/121 chapters. Know that everything is about OpsSpecs though. Those chapters are a good place to start, but the airline’s OpsSpecs will explain the company’s policies.

I also found The Turbine Pilot’s Flight Manual to helpful.

Tory

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Emily,

I would not bother to put your expired written results on your resume, at this point they are irrelevant.

I really like the Gleim Instrument Oral Exam Guide book for studying. It is a great reference for instrument rules and very easy to understand.

As for interview tips, be up on your knowledge, be personable and be able to explain why you really want to work at that particular airline.

Chris

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Emily,

Keep the resume short and sweet. They’re looking for you flight experience and what you’ve been doing since school. Everything Explained is great and be knowledgeable regarding the planes you’ve flown. Most important ANSWER the questions asked. This is the #1 mistake people interviewing make. People like to pontificate, offer their theories on life and enjoy the sound of their own voices. If the answer to the question is 7, just say 7.

Adam

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First, I’d like to thank the resident airline pilots on this forum for sharing their time and years of experience. I’m a transitioning Air Force pilot and appreciate the helpful and transparent nature of this forum.

Second, I’m new to civilian aviation and unclear about the ATP CTP as a prerequisite for the ATP (ATM) Written Exam. In this thread alone I’ve seen two conflicting answers to Ryan’s (rmoore47) initial question (“Do you have to take the ATP-CTP course prior to taking the exam?”). One person said “You will need to take the ATP CTP course prior to taking the written exam,” while another person recommended taking the ATP Written first, then having one’s hiring regional airline pay for it. Which one is it? Does the ATP CTP have to be completed before the ATP (ATM) Written or not?

Any clarification would be appreciated. Thanx! :sunglasses:

Brandon,

So, the ATP CTP has to be completed prior to taking the ATM. However, if hired by a Regional, the Regional will pay for you to attend ATP CTP.

Tory

1 Like

Tory,
Thanks for the help, amigo! :cowboy_hat_face:
Brandon

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Yup. Remember, ATP CTP does not prepare you for the ATM. They are two separate things. Sheppard Air’s test prep program is what I used to prepare for the ATM.

Tory

1 Like

Good gouge - I’ll check out Sheppard Air!

BTW, is it common for regional airlines to hire pilots who don’t have their CTP (and ATM) complete?

I ask because I’m trying to gauge whether I should spend the money and do it myself or try to find a regional to pay for it. I have 1,300 hours in the C-17 (650 PIC). Would a regional airline realistically hire a low-time guy (me) who lacks the CTP/ATM?