To me it’s never been about best pay or contract, I’m more of a corporate culture kind of guy. Hawaiian is considerably smaller than most of the Majors. Every one knows everyone and you’re not just a number. I tend to thrive better in those conditions, others don’t. To each their own and you’ll find the airline that fits you.
As for the upgrade and to successfully upgrade to Capt does take some hard work so I’ll always accept the congrats. The thing is (and many people have difficulty with this concept) as a pilot you have ABSOLUTELY ZERO CONTROL over how quickly you upgrade or not. Seniority is king and governs virtually every aspect of your career as an airline pilot. You could be the hardest working most diligent pilot in the company, if the biggest slacker is senior to you they will upgrade (or at least have the opportunity to) before you will. When I was at the Regionals the economy tanked some and we suffered some major setbacks. Some pilots were furloughed and others were downgraded. I was a fairly low seniority Capt so obviously I was concerned. EVERYONE I knew said “Adam, you’re a good pilot, you’re an instructor and everybody likes you. You won’t get downgraded”. While that’s a pleasant thought they were all wrong. Again it’s all about seniority, my number came up and a few days later I was wearing 3 stripes instead of 4 stripes.
Not trying to end this chat on a downer just clarifying that Hawaiian had more to do with my fast upgrade then I did. I did of course need to not crash the sim so…
We will have to defer to the admissions team on this one as they control such things. I have to say, I have never heard of anybody taking two introductory flights with ATP before.
I cannot speak for Kirk, but I would assume that he meant for you to take some lessons at a different flight school to help you get used to flying. ATP does not sell lessons by the hour, so this means going someplace else.
Ya I totally misunderstood obviously. I met someone at a one of my dealerships in Torrington WY who has a friend who flew with Continental for over 20 years and now runs airport and is a CFI. He said he’d be happy to take me up and we could also talk about flying and his experiences. Hey Chris so you’re saying maybe take several lessons and get my privates on my own before I start ATP or just take a few lessons… sounds like a lot of students get the PPL before starting?
Signing up for the Career Pilot Program is a HUGE commitment in time and money. If someone isn’t 100% certain aviation is for them, getting their Private first is a great way to find out with a much smaller commitment.
So it takes about 3 months to get a PPL or is that accelerated time? I just thought it was reccomended to start at zero to accelerate the whole program to get done ASAP but maybe that’s for the commercial program? Seems like I’m misunderstanding a lot, probably reading too fast!
So ATP doesn’t just offer PPL first before jumping in with commercial program to make sure you can handle it? That does make more sense to me, get my PPL first and seeing if you have what it takes and the aptitude for flying, before making that huge life changing commitment like you mentioned.
Getting your PPL can take a month or it can take years (almost 2 for me). There’s a young man on this forum who’s close to a year and $20k and still doesn’t have it. It’s definitely recommended you start from zero this way you’re learning ATP’s methods and procedures from Day 1 and have continuity throughout the program. That said ATP understands some people aren’t sure so they’ll let you start with credit for your PPL but nothing beyond that. Also understand the 3 mos the PPL portion takes with ATP is also to get you up to the 80hrs required so you have sufficient flight time for your CPL. No ATP does not just do the PPL portion. ATP trains pilots for careers as professionals. The school is not designed for those who just want to dabble or get their feet wet.
It is recommended to start from zero, but it depends on the individual. ATP does not offer just a PPL program. It’s all or nothing.
People choose to get their PPL at a local flight school for many different reasons. To list a few, some have limited availability, some don’t have the financing, some aren’t ready to make the commitment to a full time airline career program because they aren’t sure that they will be successful, others aren’t sure if they’ll still like it after getting their PPL, some aren’t aware that schools like ATP exist…you get the idea.
I got my PPL before starting ATP. I had to unlearn some bad habits that I picked up from my instructor, but obviously it wasn’t a deal breaker.
I think I’m gonna take a few lessons like Chris suggested and play it by ear because I probably don’t have the time working 60 hours. If it goes well I’ll plan on starting at zero or I’ll figure out how to get PPL first before ATP so I can at least pay for PPL upfront and loan for commercial will be 15k less starting at 50k which sounds a lot better than 65k.
Just remember, to start with credit for your PPL it’s the PPL license AND 80hrs of total time. Meaning, if you get your PPL in say 57hrs, you need to make sure you fly a min of 23hrs more to make the 80.
