Hey there I am considering this and school and that school. Really been wavering back and forth between different places. I’ve had some questions about ATP and I decided the best way to ask my questions would be to sign up here and ask. Any input will be appreciated!
First some questions about some “rumors” I’ve heard:
I heard that when ATP students become trainers they can be relocated to another ATP school in the country. That this is totally at the discretion of ATP. Is this true?
I read people saying that ATP passes only 30% of its students. Is this true?
I’ve heard that no real teaching at all goes on at ATP. Even when up in the air, lots of flight trainers care about their hours and not so much about helping the student. Is this true? If so, how do most airlines actually view ATP graduates compared to graduates from other schools?
Ok, and now just some general questions
ATP has a whole lot of partners. But I am wondering to what extent this matters? Will I really get a chance to interview with each one of these partners? I personally would like to get into Compass, Skywest, (maybe Endeavor). I’ve noticed that although Compass has a partnership with ATP, very few students actually end up going to Compass. It seems a questionably large majority go to Envoy. It makes me wonder if Envoy is the only airline giving interviews at most locations.
Does anything determine what airlines interview at what locations? For example there must be a good chance one school gets a Mesa representative, while another school never does. On the flip side, there must a good chance that another school gets a Transwest representative, but then another location doesn’t. Is it all just luck of the draw?
And somewhat related to question #4 again, “To what extent do the partnerships matter?” Just because say Compass is connected to ATP, does it actually mean I will have any more of a chance to get into Compass? Couldn’t I just interview with Compass (or any of the other ATP partners) on my own and have the same chances of being accepted or not accepted?
I don’t mean to sound cynical in any of my questions. These are just some things I’ve heard and also been wondering about. Hopefully you guys can give me your honest answers to these questions and help me make my decision. Thanks a lot
For a brief time ATP WAS assigning locations but due to popular demand you can once again chose any location you want. The only caveat is you may have to wait for availability.
Ridiculous. Think about it, ATP has been in business training pilots for the airlines for over 30yrs. If only 30% make it I pretty certain they would have closed their doors years ago. Further over 500 ATP students were hired in the last 12mos alone, are you saying 1000 washed out?
As I said OVER 500 ATP students were hired in the last 12mos and ATP has partnerships with EVERY Regional in the country. Does that not say how the airlines feel about ATP? As for the rest soooo how are ATP students learning their skills and passing their checkrides? By osmosis? Let me clarify. ATP was created BY airline pilots to train airline pilots. What that means is JUST AS THE AIRLINES don’t hold your hand and require a fair amount of self study ATP does as well. This is not due to a lack of structure or caring it’s to prepare you for the airlines. Those who can’t handle it will have an even tougher time with airline training.
It’s funny to me you’re aware of ATPs partnerships but question how ATP is viewed? Regardless, yes you can interview with any Regional you like (as long as you’re successful). You have to understand as busy as the Regionals are they ALL hire in waves and vary as which is the flavor of the month. Envoy’s “hot” right now because they have the AA flow and claim no degree is required. 2yrs ago it was Compass. When I attended it was Expressjet, etc etc.
No. It’s up to the airline and most visit closer and larger locations but AGAIN you can interview with anyone you like.
Right now the Regionals are all hiring like mad so honestly it doesn’t matter. BUT the fact and the point is that LONG before this pilot shortage and before every school started offering professional pilot programs ATP created it and their grads were getting hired.
I also want to address the whole “anti ATP” rumor questions. ATP is different than virtually every other flight school in the country and yes they do have a higher washout rate than many. You know why? Because despite the AWESOMENESS of every person in this country the fact is not everyone can or should be an airline pilot. Now most schools will continue to take your money for month (even years) and yes if you spend enough time and money you probably can earn your pilot’s license. Problem is that’s not how it works at the airlines. The airlines will give you a VERY finite amount of time to learn the material and you’ll either pass or you’re out (which is another reason for the shortage, washout rates are the highest they’ve ever been at the airlines). Like the airlines ATP will give you a finite amount of time to complete your training and yes some people are not successful. It’s easier to say “ATP doesn’t train you”, “their instructors don’t care”, “MOST of their students fail” etc than to admit maybe you just aren’t that good. As for the instructors just there to “build time” let me ask you another question? Is YOUR goal to become a flight instructor? Is that why you’re looking at flight schools? When your time comes to instruct will you be doing it for the love of instructing or will it be to build time to get to an airline? If the answer is to get to an airline that that mean ATP shouldn’t hire you because you’re going to be a lousy instructor?
I just wanted to add a but to the CFI location selection process. From ATP Admin:
When students pass their initial CFI checkride, they will be offered a CFI position with ATP and allowed to chose from a list of available locations. This initial offer satisfies ATP’s obligation of a guaranteed CFI position.
If a desired location is not available, the CFI can chose from the available locations. When a location becomes available, the position will be offered first to CFIs at overstaffed locations on a first come, first serve basis. If the position is not filled via this means, it will be offered to both new hire CFIs and CFIs from non-overstaffed locations on a first come, first serve basis.
We always invite ACPP grads who want a CFI job with us to keep checking back for their desired location. We do not keep a waitlist, but regular follow-up by an applicant serves the same purpose.
Following up on your claim that airline washout rates are at their highest rates ever, what are the rates? Highest ever sounds alarming but if its doubled from 1% to 2% or tripled to 3% that’s different than jumping from 20% to 30%. Just curious.
It varies from carrier to carrier and from class to class but yes some have been as high as 20% which is bad. Keep in mind the average newhire class is approx. 20-30 pilots so 20% is 4-6. While that’s not horrific it def tells a story.
