I may be beating a dead horse here, but I have to ask. Why ATP? I have completed a significant amount of research regarding different flight schools and have read more horror stories than stories of praise when it comes to ATP.
Is there an advanced to ATP vs local flight schools?
Financials aside (I will be getting loans) is there an advantage to ATP or Local?
Just trying to make the most informed decision when it come to a potential life changing decision.
A little background to help, I have completed many professional certification courses in my life and considered myself a dedicated student when learning. I also have 29hr towards my PPL.
The stats speak for themselves. Unfortunately, anti-ATP jargon is comparable to a Yelp review. Often times people are more compelled to give a bad review than a good one. Read between the lines and you’ll notice that no one ever takes responsibility.
Take a look at the Student Experiences section. We don’t edit, screen or censor those posts. You’ll find nothing but good in there.
ATP’s program is not a walk in the park. With the right attitude and responsibility the program may be a good fit for you as it has been for the thousands that have come before you for over 35 years.
I do not have the specific numbers in front of me now, but last I heard, ATP’s first time checkride pass rate was significantly higher than the national average. As Tory said, please check out the “Student Experiences” section for an unedited account from many current and former students.
I definitely looked at the student experiences and read Tory’s post on how to be successful. I think I’ve come to the decision that flight training will either be through a major airline sponsored training program or ATP. At 36 time is not on my side. It also seems that this is about the age that people are serious enough for these programs.
I definitely need to source an IPad first. I have animosity towards Apple so that is something I will have to get over.
I have 28-29 hrs of flight time already, should I complete PPL before attending ATP? Obviously with Tory’s post I will be completing the written exams before starting.
Why ATP? I never imagined making the memories and friendships that I have made in the last two years which can’t compare to my college or other workplace environment. Even though ATP has 70+ locations, you will always somehow reconnect with friends that you’ve made along the way. I made a lot of friends from CFI Academy that I have been able to meet up with across my journeys as a student and airline pilot in training. It truly is a wonderful environment to be apart of while turning a dream into a reality.
Back in June when I was finishing my time at ATP as an instructor the checkride pass rate was above an 84% first time pass. Across the board, 70+ locations and have that success shows that the program works no matter where you go.
As it may seem by now you’ve made your mind up about attending ATP by reading your above postings. As Adam says best, “the clock is ticking.” Everyday you wait is a day of seniority that could delay you from your dream job. I would start at ATP from where you’re currently at, I had a student with 30ish hours who finished up and then instructed underneath me when I was a Lead Instructor.
For the iPad, the only thing you need to make sure of is that it has cellular capabilities as the chip is used for GPS. There are tons of discussion regarding which iPad is used for each person, find the size that you think would be fitting in a cockpit environment and you could use for studying. I did my training and instructing with a mini, in fact typing this response on that same iPad mini and it works great.
Please let us know how else we can help answer any questions you may have. Welcome to the forum
Thank You for the response. You are right with me attending ATP. Looks like the best route at the moment. I have a application out with the horizon program but that requires a move to Oregon and that place has gotten expensive. Hopefully next week I’ll have spoken with someone in admissions and have a better idea of what I need to get done on my end.
I can’t believe how helpful everyone is. Definitely making this easier to decide!
Tory and Chris answered your question well. I simply want to add a little to address the naysayers.
I’ve been doing this a while and what I can tell you is while I honestly believe there is no better route to the airlines. That said, ATP is not for everyone and the #1 reason for that is that not everyone can or should be an airline pilot. Flying isn’t rocket science but it also isn’t basket weaving and it does require some smarts and some coordination. ATP was created BY airline pilots to TRAIN airline pilots FOR the airlines (if you notice you can’t just get your PPL, Instrument rating etc with ATP, it’s all out nothing). Newhire pilot training is highly accelerated and very challenging. You say you currently have 29hrs towards your PPL. You don’t mention whether you’ve soloed or where you are in the process but we’ll assume things are going well. The thing is if you’re instructor said to you tomorrow I think you’re ready to solo, you have the option up say “thanks, but I’m not really ready, I think I need some more training”, I guarantee your instructor will say no problem, no rush, you let me know and as long as you keep paying its all good. The problem is that’s not how it works at the airlines. Day 1 you’ll get your schedule of ALL your training including all your checks. You will either be ready or you’ll be a guy who has a great story about how he was hired to be an airline pilot but couldn’t get through training. ATP knows this and 35+yrs ago their founders developed a program to mirror this type of accelerated training (something hundreds of flight schools around the country have mimicked since the pilot shortage started). Again the fact is not everyone can cut it and it’s a whole lot easier to blame ATP that it is to admit maybe mommy was wrong and you can’t really be whatever you want in the world. These people are quick to get online to try and defend their failure. You know who’s not online? The literally thousands of successful ATP grads who are now flying for the airlines (over 1200 in the last 12mos alone).
There’s an old saying, a happy customer tells their friend, an unhappy customer tells EVERYBODY.
“Flying isn’t rocket science but it also isn’t basket weaving”
Thank you for that, I did get a laugh out of that one! I have soloed before but it was many years ago. I feel very comfortable in a aircraft and have been in many emergency situations on the ground (firefighter/emt/divemaster) so I definitely cannot blame anyone but myself. The more that everyone responds I feel that this is the right decision!
I recently updated my medical to 2nd Class, unfortunately the Ame could not do a 1st class. I’ve heard of a 90day wait before the ability to upgrade. I have no issues that would cause any inability to receive 1st class just don’t know how it will affect application to the program.
Don
You’d have to check with admin but if you’re anxious to start, I’d think they might allow your 2ndClass with a letter from your AME stating he sees no problem with you getting your 1st.
That will be my route if I start before the 90 days, if not I’m coming in with 1st class in hand. Alright, enough from me already. I’m going to be reaching out on Monday and will update along the way! Thank you for you help @Adam@Chris@Brady@Tory you all are awesome!
There really is not much to do with sourcing an iPad, you simply go to apple.com, but the correct one and two days later it shows up. You will need to get over your animosity towards Apple as the vast majority of airlines use iPads.
I would not delay a start date to work on the writtens. If you have time before you start, then sure, work on them, but if you can start the program sooner, then by all means do so. The programs actually designed for the written to be completed during the program.
That is your call on whether to finish your PPL first or not. I would say that if you are not terribly current in flying, then it would probably make sense to start over.
At 36 you are not too old, but you are certainly not young either. I would not waste too much time, if this is what you want to do, you need to go for it,
You said you have 29 hours toward your PPL. Have you soloed? How proficient do you feel? How many hours have you flown in the last 30 days?
These are all questions to help you decide which program to start, if you decide ATP is for you.
If you feel as though you’re “on a roll” working towards your PPL, by all means continue and finish it out. I just want you to be aware of the prerequisites for starting the program credit private. It includes 78 hours total time and 8 XC. You need that to ensure you have enough hours to meet future certificate requirements.
However, if you haven’t flown in a while and feel as though you haven’t made as much progress as you’d like, it might be better to start Zero Time so the foundation of your training is solid.
I’ll post the link to all the prerequisites below:
I have soloed but I will be starting from zero with ATP. It has been over 10 years since the bulk of that time was logged. I have to talk to admissions tomorrow. I am also thinking any extra hours definitely don’t hurt. Just looked at my log book and 4.5 hrs pic so definitely a Zeros start. Thanks for the advice!
I’m just a android guy so I will get over it (at some point lol). That issue is the mini or the regular iPad, maybe i will try them out at one of those fancy stores Apple has.
Definitely wanting to start ASAP so that helps out alot.
Since I’m a early riser (pst) admissions and I will be talking first thing over coffee. I also have looked at the training schedule and I absolutely love seeing 7days a week training. This is one part of other schools that I’ve never understood. I have talked with many schools over the year and actually all of the schools have told me that they do not recommend that training schedule. I find this very odd considering every professional certification that I have received (for the most part) requires a full time commitment. This to me is one of the most compelling reasons to join ATP, along with placement and overall experience (all the pilot mentors helped greatly).
As your time is over ten years old, I would absolutely recommend starting from zero with ATP. Much has changed in the last ten years and you are undoubtedly very rusty. Your flight time will still count towards your total time.
I cannot fathom why a school would recommend against training seven days per week, that is directly against how the airlines and the military train pilots.
That has been the biggest reason I started looking into ATP. It was such a surprise when a couple different schools said that I actually couldn’t train full time and I quote one instructor “I don’t trust anyone who completes their training that fast”. I ran for the door and never looked back. I know divemaster is no where near as demanding as any rating but that was a full time commitment and I ended up working for the dive shop to give myself more hours to complete training. I’m just glad I found ATP and all the mentors here.
Sooooo they don’t trust military and airline pilots? Cause that’s they way they/we train.
The reason other schools discourage full-time training is simple. It’s because they don’t have the resources (airplanes and instructors) to accommodate full-time training.
That is definitely a thought that crossed my mind. There is more to that school, most of the experience would be wildly inappropriate to post here but long story short that place couldn’t even produce numbers for how many students completed PPL in the last 12 months. Professionalism and transparency are what I value from a school, ATP seems to be one of the better examples of this.
